a car lift in your shop



a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » September 17th, 2008, 3:54 pm

read thru this thread. and the linked info,provided, it will be well worth the effort
before you purchase a lift call the state better business and local states attorney, in the state that is selling that lift and ask questions about complaints,involving that business theres a good deal of scam artists in this business, look thru the internet, look for rip-off reports


11 feet is about the average minimum ceiling height required for full height lifts, keep in mind most cars are about 5-6 feet tall and you need about 6 foot of clearance under the lift to work, be sure you measure WHERE YOUR GOING TO INSTALL THE LIFT then call your lift supplier BEFORE ORDERING A LIFT to BE SURE IT WILL FIT, if you are buying a two post lift check with the manufacturer about minimum floor strength /thickness required

Id point out that most two and most four post lifts require a 10-11 foot ceiling height simply cause most cars are 5-6 feet tall, and most people at 5.5-6.5 tall who work on cars thus to stand erect under the car youll need that height, obviously if you use a mechanics creeper you cut that requirement drastically lower as you only need 2-4 feet under the car to work, and get full access.
there are two post lifts that are only 8-9 foot tall but shop carefully for any lift and ask about certifications,many import lifts and some domestic lifts are cheap crap, that are not safe!
most four post lifts will bolt to almost any shop floor, some are even designed to roll around when there's nothing being lifted on them,[b] a two post lift will generally need a 6"-8" thick solid concrete floor to anchor to securely and before you buy one you should consult both the manufacturer and drill your floor concrete to verify the slab thickness , and if its not adequate youll need to pout footers for the lift columns
in most cases its 6" minimum, if you have only the typical 3"-4" slab youll need a footer poured,
when you plan a garage you might want to remember most lifts require a 11-13 ft ceiling clearance and if the car or truck is 5-6ft tall and your 6ft tall you need a 13 ft ceiling height to work on the car while standing up under it, it also helps to run the garage door roller track way up the inside wall for storage for as much distance as possible because a door stored vertically along the inside wall doesn,t block over head lighting or fans or potentially get into clearance issues with the car while up on a lift, one of my friends failed to think about that and has to close the garage door to put a car up on the lift, or it hits the horizontally stored door that has tracks that store the open door at about 8 ft off the shop floor
[/b]
read thru these links and this thread carefully, 4" of concrete is marginal, or even dangerous with a two post lift, Id strongly suggest talking to the lift manufacturer about options, personally Id strongly suggest sinking/installing 4' x'4' x 2' feet concrete footers, tied into the slab, having a car over your head that might pull the anchor bolts is stupid at best, and a few yards of 5000 psi concrete will cost far less than your medical bills and car repair if a car falls when the anchor bolts pull free
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potential results of a small base, two post, lift installed on a 4" slab, in most cases manufacturers indicate a two post lift needs a MINIMUM of 6"-to 8" of concrete floor thickness and a minimum of 3600 psi concrete with 6"-8" anchor bolts to effectively and safely anchor a two post lift

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQlIWTWEWKw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLUjq6ijvVc
on a 4 post lift its a fairly strait forward deal if youve got instructions, but on a TWO POST lift your concrete floor thickness and concrete strength are factors that need to be seriously considered.
if your using the lift to store a car and allow a second car to occupy the same floor space a 4 post lift is ideal, if your using the lift mostly for working on a car ,, brakes,suspension engine,exhaust etc. a quality two post lift has several advantages.
but after using my buddys 4 post lift and having my QUALITY 2 post lift I can,t even imagine swapping to a 4 post unless all your doing is storing a car up out of the way and gaining useable floor space, theres just far to many things that are easy to access with a good two post that are a P.I.T.A. using a 4 post design

HERES ONE COMPANYS CONCRETE PAD SUGGESTIONS

http://www.rotarylift.com/uploadedFiles/FAQ1.pdf

you might want to keep in mind that if you screw it up or the lift fails and YOU installed it vs the factory reps that the manufacturer is 90% sure to blame faulty installation as the major cause, while thats seriously less likely with a factory rep installing it
when I first started looking at lifts I was convinced I wanted a drive-on style 4 post design, but after talking to several dozen corvette mechanics I was totally convinced of the advantages of a QUALITY two post lift, which is mainly far more access under the car and especially better wheel and suspension component access.[/color][/size]
if you've got ceiling clearance issues, or can,t install a permanent lift heres a couple options

http://www.kwik-lift.com/

http://www.ezcarlift.com/ezcarlift_video.html

[/color][/size]


SHOP CAREFULLY, HERES AN EXAMPLE COMPARING TWO SIMILAR LOOKING LIFTS,
THERES NO COMPARING STRENGTH
READ THRU THIS LIST OF QUESTIONS

http://www.mohawklifts.com/wp/consumer/ ... ost-lifts/

http://www.bestbuyautoequipment.com/v/B ... y-Lift.htm
the BENDPACK HAS A GOOD DEAL MORE MASSIVE PARTS AND A BETTER DESIGN[/size][/b][/color]

http://www.autolift.org/members.htm

http://www.autolift.org/purchasing.htm

http://www.ali-directory.org/ali/ali2.n ... e?OpenForm

this should help
ID STRONGLY SUGGEST NOT BUYING A CHINESE BUILT LIFT AND BUYING FROM AN AMERICAN MANUFACTURER
/KEEP IN MIND THAT PARTS AVAILABILITY IN THE FUTURE AN SERVICE IS FAR MORE IMPORTANT THAN SAVING A FEW BUCKS ON THE UP FRONT COST
both the two post and four post designs have advantages and disadvantages, the question you should ask yourself first is WHATS the MAIN purpose of the lift......if its storage the 4 post is easier to deal with, but if you actually work on the car frequently I can,t see any real choice but a quality two post lift, especially if access for brake jobs and suspension work, and easy drive train access is important to you.

THE CERTIFICATION STICKER IS MANDATORY ON A DECENT LIFT

http://www.autolift.org/
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any lift worth having will have this sticker, its NOT just a "STICKER" its a certification that the lift design HAS BEEN TESTED and will function under its rated load plus about 30%-50%, and that it meets some minimum safety feature requirements.
A certification for any product serves several purposes. The one that no one sees is consistency of manufacture. That's a big one and the one that should concern you with a product like a lift.

obviously theres always going to be a few IDIOTS that should never be allowed to operate machinery, who have accidents, but its at least reassuring to know that the basic lift is unlikely to structurally fail.
listed members,(below) but be aware in a few cases the same vendor may sell , BOTH certified and NON-CERTIFIED LIFTS, look for the sticker in the advertising and on the lift
http://www.autolift.org/members.htm
look at the listed members with certified lifts


any lift without that sticker is more than likely import junk that can,t pass safety testing

KEEP IN MIND THAT IF THE COMPANY YOUR DEALING WITH...

http://www.ali-directory.org/ALI/ALI2.n ... d%20Rating

DOES NOT HAVE,their physical ADDRESS displayed,
THAT'S A HUGE RED FLAG.........PROBABLY an EXCELLENT indicator to avoid them


IF they DON'T advertise their lifts as
ALI certified/validated by ETL
THAT'S A HUGE RED FLAG.........

IF THERE'S NO LOCAL DEALER
IF theres NO LOCAL INSTALLER AND REPAIR
THAT'S A HUGE RED FLAG.........

TAKE THE TIME TO DO RESEARCH and FIND OUT WHAT SEVERAL PREVIOUS CUSTOMERS THINK, HOW LONG THE COMPANY'S BEEN IN BUSINESS , ETC.
look on the internet for complaints and check with the state BBB about the company you are thinking of dealing with as several SCAM ARTISTS ARE IN THIS BUSINESS, ALL WAYS PAY WITH A CREDIT CARD< NOT CASH OR CHECK OR MONEY ORDER, so if you never get the lift the charges can be disputed,
ID also suggest going by several local dealerships and corvette clubs and asking what brands of lifts they prefer,and they use and how the parts availability and maintenance gets handled , if you don,t have access to repair parts from a dependable source in a few years you bought expensive junk, and these imported china knock-off brands go out of business after they sell off stock on hand so they don,t maintain a repair parts inventory

remember the price is only one factor, theres no gain in getting a good price on JUNK that can,t be repaired, something that parts are not going to be available for in a few years or something that will sooner or later get you killed, due to crappy workmanship or design or something being made out of marginally crappy steel, or thin steel to save weight but costing your lift strength......theres a GOOD REASON ITS CHEAPER, ITS WORTH A GOOD DEAL LESS AND IN MOST OF THE CASES, you TEND too GET what you pay for!
what have you gained if the damn lift stops working and you can,t get it repaired or fails and you or your car is seriously damaged or totaled, will that great low price off set ,being crippled for life or dead ,
check with each manufacturer before you buy a lift,
keep firmly in mind that most two post lifts requires a 6" or thicker concrete slab or a separate footer be installed in the shop floor to safely anchor the base of the support posts to prevent any potential tipping, most shop floors are 2"-3" thick if no lift was planned during their construction




BTW I bought the lift design and brand and model I did after closely inspecting several brands at several dealerships and repair shops and asking about repairs and support and if they had any problems after years of use, the lift I selected had rave reviews from mechanics

keep in mind that the better two post designs take up far less floor space than a 4 post lift and allow more access to the wheels and suspension and under the car drive train, on the down side they generally require a 4"-6"-8" MINIMUM concrete floor thickness, (something you might not have in a standard garage floor) (yes you can install a footer but that's an extra expense!) its always best that you can contact the lift company for their suggestions,and perhaps check the local building codes. your current floor may be fine with a standard or over size base plate which can be added to most lift designs, but several of my friends with older shops , simply figured out exactly where the two post lift base would be located and busted out some concrete,in a 4 foot box with the post location at its center and dug out two twin, 4 ft sq and 18-24" deep boxes, lined them with some rebar and plastic sheet and poured the recess with 3500psi concrete, and smoothed out the surface to match the original floor,

thats about one cubic yard, to maybe 1.2 cubic yard,s of high strength concrete for each post and its worked out just fine, around here thats about $130 a yard and damn cheap life insurance
two post designs are a bit harder to get the car up on correctly and safely , because you don,t just drive onto them but need to swing the arms under the car and line up the support pads on the frame,but they are every bit as sturdy once properly installed and used correctly


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heres the 9000 lb rated lift I purchased and had installed after going to dozens of local shops and dealerships and talking to the mechanics about what lifts they found to be the best and most durable, and lifts having had the least problems or service issues
HERES THE LIFT I CHOSE
Model 9000SI (Clear-Floor Symmetrical Style 9000 lb. capacity twin-post Lift)

Specifications
http://www.ben-pearson.com/twin-post_1092_c.aspx?pp=0
Ben Pearson's 9000SI Two-Post
Solid features separate this lift from the pack

Compare feature for feature, the 9000SI beats the competition hands down.
We could talk about quality. We could talk about the rugged durability. We could talk about the design. But we let the features do the talking for us;Single-Point Safety Release; Two Independent Heavy-Duty Hydraulic Cylinders; Convenient Stack-Pad System; Clear Floor Design: Automatic Arm Restraining System; ALI certified/validated by ETL - and that's just the beginning.

If Quality is what you're looking for, you'll find it in Ben Pearson's 9000SI Two-Post.
The reasons are simple, we build each lift to exacting specifications. Plus, we don't build any lift to meet our needs, we build them to meet your needs.

ALI certified/validated by ETL
Single point safety release
Padded overhead shut-off bar
2-5/8" & 5" truck adapters included
Extra long carriage for smooth lifting
Convenient stack-pad storage rack on post
Automatic engage and release arm restraint
Extra large ultra-high molecular bearing blocks
Low profile arms for low ground clearance
Optional height extension kits for taller vehicles
Clear floor design for convenient use of floor jacks


Precise and efficient automatic arm restraining system engages
in the lifting process and automatically releases once the lift is
lowered. Eliminates wasted time releasing up to 4 independent
pull-type releases. Utilizes a multi-toothed gear mechanism for
maximum arm locking positions.

The operator convenient stack-pad system consists of
(4) 2-5/8" adapters and (4) 5" truck adapters as standard
equipment with every 9000 series Ben Pearson 2-post lift.
A convenient stack-pad storage rack is located on each post.

Low profile arms for low ground clearance vehicles.

Optional power station utility box mounts on the left column
providing convenient access to two air outlets and four ground
fault electrical outlets. Built-in air regulator, water separator and
oiler, with tool holster and hooks, keep the bay area productive
and efficient.

The EH1 and EH2 optional extended height kits are available
for the 9AI and 9SI

LINKS to MANY of the Auto lift suppliers
http://www.autolift.org/

http://www.autolift.org/purchase_considerations.pdf

http://www.kwik-lift.com/

http://www.geminilift.com/

http://revolutionlift.com/

http://www.ben-pearson.com/twin-post_1092_c.aspx?pp=0

http://www.hunter.com/pub/product/racks/index.htm

http://www.challengerlifts.com/products.shtml

http://www.directlift.com

http://www.gregsmithequipment.com/

http://www.ezcarlift.com/

http://www.levo-artis.com/

http://www.backyardbuddy.com

http://www.gregsmithequipment.com/Atlas ... ison-Guide

http://www.autolifts.com

http://www.maxjaxusa.com/specifications.html

http://www.westernhoist.com/

http://www.stingerlifts.com

http://www.doublepark.net

http://www.mohawklifts.com

http://www.autolifters.com

http://www.bendpak.com/

http://www.gregsmithequipment.com/Atlas-BP-9F

http://www.bendpak.com/product_info.isg?products_id=881

http://www.rotarylift.com/

http://eagleequip.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=LI

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=26&p=34#p34

ok having just gone thru this , Id point out that theres a HUGE difference in the REPLACEMENT PARTS availability and TECH SUPPORT availability and getting the lift installed correctly between the American made and Chinese built lifts, you probably DON,T WANT a 12,000 lb lift unless you exclusively work on larger trucks as the lift arms may not have the necessary clearance to use on low slung cars
a 9000 lb lift will handle almost all personal cars/trucks.
IF YOU FIND WHAT YOU THINK IS A GREAT DEAL ON A NEW LIFT< STOP AND DO SOME RESEARCH BEFORE SPENDING YOUR CASH!!
I really don,t want too "RAIN ON YOUR PARADE"
but even MORE I don,t want you to fail to do the research BEFORE you buy a lift with the result that you get seriously injured when it fails and having seen several lifts that were "BARGAIN PRICED DEALS OF A LIFE-TIME" fail to do much more than cause cash to change hands and the purchaser feel they got totally screed in the process or have the lift fail shortly after it was installed I just say DO THE RESEARCH CAREFULLY BEFORE THE PURCHASE, and CONTACT THE LOCAL BBB office and check the internet before purchasing and for darn sure use a credit card that can dispute charges, if what you get (IF ANYTHING) does not match the description

heres what I finally bought and had installed, keep in mind that the higher the lifts weight rating the larger the arms need to be and the more difficult it will be to use on low ground clearance cars like corvettes/camaros ETC. and you'll rarely find personal cars/trucks over 6000lbs in weight with most being well under 4000-4500lbs

heres the lift I purchased, I felt it was the best value, HAD THE BEST SERVICE SUPPORT AND BEST ACCESS UNDER THE CAR, ACCESS TO THE WHEELS, TRANSMISSION,EXHAUST, etc.

http://www.ben-pearson.com/9000si.shtml

old pictures taken the first week I had the lift while I was sticking stuff from the old shop in my new garage

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btw I purchased a two post lift on the advice of several repair shops after being convinced and thinking at first that I wanted a 4 post lift, they pointed out that access to the brakes and suspension and under the corvette working on the drive train the access was better.
now Id purchased the two post lift and have been using it for awhile and went over to help a buddy with his 4 post lift, putting the car up on the lift is far easier with the four post , and it looked and worked just fine, but after that I found the guys at the repair shops were totally correct, working access under the corvette sucked compared to my 2 post lift.

all Im suggesting is think thru your choice, if your doing mostly oil changes and storage, like using the lift to allow access for a second car, a 4 post is a far better choice but if your deep into various repairs, especially on the brakes and suspension, and engine swaps a two post might be a better choice, especially if you think about the area the lift takes up in floor space when its not in use

keep in mind you have a choice of 2 or 4 post is based on what you plan to do most. 4 posts are better for storage but you will be driven crazy working around the support ramps 10 minutes through the first job if you are working on wheels or brakes, exhaust systems etc.. I makes no difference how much you spend on the lift, if it is not anchored on a GOOD THICK concrete base, with the correct anchors and in concrete of the correct composition it will be dangerous, to work under ID strongly suggest a MINIMUM of an 8" thick 3500psi concrete slab under a two post lift and a 4"-6" slab under a 4 post. many standard garage floors are only 2"-3" thick and made from 2300psi concrete so a custom FOOTER might be, required under the lift base, being necessary, to provide the required stability,check with your lift manufacturer for specs.
http://www.ben-pearson.com/9000si.shtml

BTW BEFORE YOU DECIDE TO SAVE MONEY BY DRIVING TO THE MANUFACTURERS DOCK, LOADING IT ONTO A TRAILER AND DRIVING IT HOME, AND SAVE THE SHIPPING COSTS

If you have it delivered,from out of state, in most cases you will not pay sales tax. Consider the tax, AND COST OF THE GAS AND POSSIBLY THE TRAILER RENTAL FEES, versus the shipping cost before you decide to go pick it up.


BTW I was asked why I didn,t do the install myself and had the factory reps do the install?
I LOVE MY LIFT and IVE had no problems with it, I also thought the cost to have it installed was rather high, but it took two experienced guys about 4-to-5 hours to do it and I figured it was well worth the cost if I ever had problems, because , experience has taught me that the warranty , on ANY LIFT, would have been virtually worthless, from any company ,if it ever came to a law suit, as EVERY problem would instantly be (BECAUSE OF IMPROPER INSTALLATION) IF the factory did not install it?


the CLEAR FLOOR FEATURE is a HUGE PLUS, as it makes use or a mechanics creeper or transmission jack far easier
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
grumpyvette

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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » September 22nd, 2008, 8:07 pm

http://www.aclifts.com/parking/pss-7.asp

got an extra $50K this might interest you!(ABOVE)
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adding a lazer pointer parking assist will help you easily park the car in exactly the location in the garage you want to allow easy access to the car without dinging the doors on walls etc. and its most helpful in getting the lift arms to swing into place on the cars frame if you can consistently center the car correctly between the lifts support posts but its going to cost $20-$30 to do it in most cases plus occasional battery replacement

btw,if your garage has limited floor space or ceiling height, if you install one of theses dual laser pointers on the ceiling over your lift and place two mini dots on the cars dash pad, you can see the laser dots on the hood and with minimal practice, youll be able to perfectly line up and locate the car over the lift arms each time
(a drop of orange nail polish, on each side of the dash works great)
you can pull into the area of the lift and locate your car EXACTLY with the correct forward/backward and SIDE CLEARANCE EVERY TIME, especially if you have a lift that requires the car be parked both forward and back plus side too side in a location on the shop floor so that the two post lifts swing arms are easily moved under the cars frame to be in a rather limited area, due to the wheel base and tires restricting the swing arms motion, to reach the cars frame easily

OR you might want to hang a bright orange or green florescent tennis ball or two from the garage roof rafters so it , or they,just touch some easily seen and repeatable place(s) on the car like the tip of a wind shield wiper once you find the exact best location to park the car in that garage , thus allowing you to consistently pull the car into the exact location you prefer without taking the chance of hitting some part of the wall with the car or finding the door won,t open without hitting the wall etc.
yes they make lazer pointer parking aids that do the same thing in a rather high tech way, but a bit of 50 lb fishing line a big thumb tack a brightly colored tennis ball and a 10 cent screw eye will cost you less than a dollar,
and if you want to get fancy tire location stop mats also help properly locate the cars tires for easy use of a 2 post lifts arms under the cars frame.......you can also rig the lines holding the ball (S) so that closing the garage door lifts the locating balls out of the way and only having the door open allows them to descend to the cars level

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http://www.elitegaragefloors.com/park-s ... rking-mat/

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http://www.microfiber-products-online.com/ap2--db.html
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http://www.kwik-lift.com/
and these ramps and a floor jack make access under the car rather easy, plus they are something that you can take with you if you move to a new garage easily un-like most lifts

http://www.kwik-lift.com/index.html
IF you have limited height the QUICK LIFT RAMPS MIGHT BE AN OPTION
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you should watch thru these videos, it can save you time and effort

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBEKegyZ ... e=youtu.be

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tv4-ieB3 ... ws&list=SL

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5lY9QMY ... ws&list=SL

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9r1ryos ... re=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bmaQmoJ ... re=related
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
grumpyvette

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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » November 11th, 2008, 8:33 pm

almost all two post lift accidents fall into two categories,
structural failures and operator errors
or a combo of both
WHEN YOU SEE ACCIDENTS THERE'S A reason

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLUjq6ijvVc

watch this

looking closely at that lift, IN THE PICTURE I think its mostly structural failure, look very closely the arms appear to be damaged (especially the left arm set)and theres no lift pads on any of the arms,LOOK CLOSELY AT THE PICTURE OF MY LIFT ABOVE TO SEE THE RUBBER PADS which makes me suspect an idiot used it without them installed,and he never paid attention to the lift as it was set-up on the car or during the operation,....btw can anyone read the brand

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ID bet these failed lifts were bargain priced Chinese imports , NOT a CERTIFIED AMERICAN MADE LIFTs
THE CERTIFICATION STICKER IS MANDATORY ON A DECENT LIFT[/color]
http://www.autolift.org/
Image
http://www.autolift.org/members.htm

I talked with easily 20 repair shops before I bought my lift, and I was 100% convinced, before I started out , asking questions. that I wanted a nice 4 post lift, (obviously driving onto a four post is easier than positioning lift arms under a car frame)but after talking with shop after shop that was doing constant repairs it slowly dawned on me that I was seeing very few shops using the 4 post lifts and every last mechanic suggested a quality two post as being more versatile.
now theres no question that its easier to put the car up on a four post or that you can do a good deal of work if you have the sliding bridge jack adapters, but before you make a decision talk to at least 6-8 shops and ask questions

btw theres cheaper lifts but this is a good one and IF I can afford it this will probably be my second lift in the shop, but I can,t see having one lift and having it be a 4 post design

http://www.eagleequip.com/page/EE/PROD/LI-SS/HD-9STX

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typical 4 post lift makes getting the car up on the lift easy and once up you can usually store a second car under it , but working on the suspension wheels, brakes ant at times on the exhaust is a P.I.T.A.
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a typical two post lift takes more effort to position the lift arms on the frame of the car but once the cars up,it allows almost unlimited access to the suspension drive train and exhaust systems ETC.
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
grumpyvette

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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » November 12th, 2008, 2:14 pm

IF for some reason you need custom jack extensions for clearance issues with your two post lift,if all other options fail,and you need custom jack extensions a trip to a local machine shop with a set of well designed plans and a thick wallet will cure the problem,OR careful measurable, some thought, and careful fabrication and use of the DECENT SHOP WELDER ....
IM SURE MOST GUYS HAVE (OR SHOULD HAVE)
will have the problem resolved in a short time..
naturally that might involve a trip to get metal, and some fabrication time, but youll be amazed at what can be accomplished, I know IM always amazed at how frequently a shop welder is used, once you own and know how to use one, and how many times guys without one just get stopped from doing projects, or even contemplating doing some projects

one of my friends just bought this welder
and so far it looks like an excellent choice

http://www.millerwelds.com/products/mig/millermatic_211_autoset/

the better two post lifts come with several sets of pad extenders
that make lifting a corvette with side pipes no problem

example
http://www.ben-pearson.com/9000si.shtml

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=98

look at the accessory pictures
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thats a great example of WHY doing some research BEFORE you purchase a lift is so important


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http://www.eagleequip.com/page/EE/PROD/LI-LM/PAD-6000W
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IVE used them, their less expensive too buy and very easy too use but unless your doing mostly brake jobs and wheel and suspension related work and maybe oil changes most of them are a P.I.T.A. or useless for many jobs and access under the car is very limited and unsafe in my opinion.


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http://www.kwik-lift.com/

heres one exception, its open under the car, bur access is still limited
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http://www.automotivetools.com/cgi-loca ... ?E+scstore

I still think the best value for most guys on a tight budget is purchaseing (4) 12 ton jack stands , decent ramps and two floor jacks, you can do 90% of the stuff you want to do on a car if youve got a decent flat concrete pad with those and have well under $600 invested and its easily transported when you move, I used them for many years before I got my lift and still use them frequently today
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/d ... mber=34924


I bought three sets of these and Ive found them to be perfectly fine (ONE OF THE VERY FEW THINGS IVE GOTTEN FROM HF THAT WAS)at some point it just doesn,t make sense to make things cheaper or from inferior materials because the product is so low tech and the cost of materials is so close it makes no sense to try to get it built for less, as theres almost no potential to save on manufacturing costs (feel the 12 ton jack stands are probably in that catagory)


http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/d ... mber=34924
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12 ton jack stands #34924

normally $80 for two, now on sale for $55 for two


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"1: why 12 ton? Ain't 6 ton more than enough?
2: how do you jack up the car? do you enroll your wife?
3: what floor jack do you use? Prices vary quite a bit?"

(1)
the
12 ton are BOTH FAR MORE STABILE from tipping or the car shifting, AND on the first notch they are exactly the correct height to allow comfortably accessing the under side of the car, place the 6 ton next to a 12 ton and raise both to the height of the 12 ton stands on the first notch, theres absolutely no comparison in your safety under the car, THERES ABSOLUTELY NO WAY YOU CAN COMPARE THE DEGREE OF STABILITY THE LARGER BASE AND STRONGER MATERIALS THE 12 TON STANDS PROVIDE

(2)OK first you DON,T raise a vette one corner at a time! you drive it up on the ramps to get clearance for the jack then slide the floor jack under the center of the front (CROSS MEMBER) and lift the front and place BOTH front 12 ton jack stands, under the frame , wide spaced, then the angle allows you to either use a second floor jack or move the front floor jack to the rear of the vette, and lift the whole back and place both REAR 12 ton jack stands, on the rear frame. now personally I usually leave the rear jack stands and the jack holding the rear up ,and the 12 ton jack stands on the front with the tires hanging just above the ramps, that way theres almost no chance the vette can fall, even if some component were to fail.
Ill ALSO point out I have and have always used two floor jacks, twin rino ramps and 4 12 ton jack stand WHEN I was under the corvette as I don,t want to be doing bench presses with a vette!


(3)theres several deals available, and the quality varies wildly, youll need to shop, http://www2.northerntool.com/product/200345429.htm

this jack looks good in the info they posted, but if you can afford it ID buy two, so you can jack the frame with a buddies help with minimal frame twist.
I have two craftsman floor jacks and while they have worked well for years Id more than likely have purchased those if Id know about them at the time I bought them

http://www.digitalcorvettes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80388&highlight=stands

http://www.digitalcorvettes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17203


this also has some decent info(above)

Image

BTW Ive seen this style stand cause accidents several times, only an idiot in my opinion trusts his life too a 1/4" bolt of predetermined sheer strength, and thats ALL thats keeping those from dropping un-expectedly
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » November 22nd, 2008, 11:52 am

personal opinion!
that looks like an EXCELLENT WAY to have a car pre- set -up too fall off a lift, look at it this way,simple geometry says supporting each corner is far more stabile than ballancing the car fron the center even if the total foot print of the 4 jack stands was only equal to the single lift base, the lift is far less stabile than a quality jack stand placed under each corner of the car and you would be out of your mind to place the car that high on jack stands that are not anchored down,,so why would a lift thats not anchored down and less stable be a good option, one good shove and that cars over on its side, that and the fact theres little or nothing gained in access under the car with that lift, over 4 12 ton jack stands once the tires clear the floor by a few inches, and you can easily use a mechanics creeper to access most of it
Image

http://kwiklift.com/commercial.htm

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=98

at least with these two designs the base is wide enought to be more stabile

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IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby FRISKY » December 6th, 2008, 2:00 pm

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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » December 6th, 2008, 2:05 pm

if you look VERY CLOSELY it appears the roof rack on the van jams against something, maybe the door frame or part of the ceiling anf the extra load, as the lift trys to compress the van against the ceiling busted the lift.
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby FRISKY » December 12th, 2008, 1:05 pm

grumpyvette wrote:if you look VERY CLOSELY it appears the roof rack on the van jams against something, maybe the door frame or part of the ceiling anf the extra load, as the lift trys to compress the van against the ceiling busted the lift.
Either that or the lifting cable was off the pulley or broken on that corner and it wasn't lifting. The more the other three legs lifted, the more that corner tilted that one leg sideways to the point of breaking.
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » February 26th, 2009, 5:51 pm

http://www.americanautomotiveequipment.com/

ABSOLUTELY DO NOT BUY FROM THESE GUYS!

IM JUST LIKE MOST GUYS, A BIT TOO TRUSTING AND LOOKING FOR A GOOD PRICE, WHEN I FIRST WENT LOOKING FOR A LIFT, I LOOKED AT SEVERAL COMPANIES, I ORDERED A LIFT AND PAID FOR IT WITH A VISA, FROM THESE GUYS, THEY NEVER SHIPPED THE LIFT< ALL I GOT WAS EXCUSES, THE ONLY WAY I GOT MY MONEY BACK WAS VISA REIMBURSED ME,
THEN I GOT SMARTER AND STARTED DOING SOME REAL RESEARCH INTO BOTH LIFT QUALITY AND THE COMPANY REPUTATIONS FOR STANDING BEHIND THEIR PRODUCTS
IT WAS ONLY AFTER I TOOK THE TIME AND EFFORT TO TALK TO MOST OF THE LOCAL SHOPS AND DEALERSHIPS THAT I DECIDED ON A QUALITY TWO POST LIFT RATHER THAN A FOUR POST, AND I STARTED TO LEARN ABOUT THE HUGE DIFFERENCES IN QUALITY,MATERIALS,REPLACEMENT PARTS AVAILABILITY AND DEALER SUPPORT AND REPUTATIONS THAT IT BECAME OBVIOUS THAT THERE WAS A GREAT DEAL OF CHEAP/SHODDY CRAP BEING SOLD AND SCAMS IN THIS MARKET


OR THESE GUYS
http://www.superlifts.com

http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Superior- ... ver-483493


theres always a small percentage of idiots with a death wish
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IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » January 4th, 2010, 4:52 pm

In Part 1, we covered basic elevation and support devices that are viable alternatives to vehicle lifts for a plethora of chores. However, there are times when you absolutely need a lift to get the job done, and some lifts will also provide you with additional vehicle storage space in your garage, and that is what we're going to cover here.
There are several things you'll need to consider before you go lift shopping:
* purpose* price* elevation* capacity* locking* drive-on/frame-contact* mounting* voltage* 2-post/4-post* warranty* accessories* domestic/imported
PurPose
What is your intended purpose for buying a lift? In large part, the kind of lift you actually get will be determined by the answer to this question. Do you intend to do restoration, repair, and/or maintenance to your Corvette? Will you be using it to work on other vehicles as well? Do you want to elevate the car so you can park another vehicle underneath it? Do you just want another neat toy for your garage with the inherent bragging rights that come with it? Perhaps all these things? Only you can answer these questions, so that is where you should start.
Price
Having champagne taste on a beer budget is the next thing you'll have to sort out. How much can and are you willing to spend on a lift? Bear in mind you will get what you pay for with this purchase, so it really doesn't pay to be penny wise and dollar foolish. Also remember this is literally a once-in-a-lifetime purchase, so you'd be wise to allocate enough money to buy a lift that will keep you happy and do everything you expect of it for many years to come.
Elevation
The height of your garage and your intended use for the lift both come into play when making this decision. For example, if you have 10 feet between the floor and the rafters of your garage, you'll have about 6 feet of clearance to work and walk under the lift when the Corvette is on it, which is fine for most people, unless you are extremely tall. Conversely, if you only have 8 feet of rafter clearance, then you'll only have about 4 feet of space between the ground and the bottom of the car when it's on the lift, so this is definitely something you need to think about before making a purchase decision. And this will also be an issue with regards to the height of your garage door, should you decide to get a caster kit to make the lift moveable; if your garage door height is less than the posts of the lift on casters, you won't be able to roll it out into the driveway to work in nice weather.
You may also decide that you don't need to have full-height elevation, and if that is the case, you should consider a mid-rise lift that will give you a few feet of ground clearance, and these can save you quite a bit of money. If a mid-rise lift sounds like it's worth investigating further, bear in mind that you can get models like the Kwiklift that don't require any electricity and can be disassembled, moved, and stored easily, too.
Capacity
Since all Corvettes are well under 4,000 pounds, a 2-ton capacity lift should be sufficient, right? Well, yes and no -this goes back to your first answer to the purpose question. If you're going to use the lift to do work on your truck, SUV, or other vehicle(s), then you'll want a lift with adequate capacity to handle these as well. I'm a big proponent of "more is better" when it comes to tools and equipment, and for this reason, I highly recommend going with a lift that exceeds your lifting requirements. Even if you don't think you'll need a 3- or 4-ton capacity lift now, things may change down the road a bit, and you may need the extra capacity then. Generally speaking, there isn't a tremendous price difference for the higher-capacity models among most manufacturers, so spending a few extra bucks for a stronger lift is something to give some serious thought to.
An economical and non-electric lift is the kwiklift. you drive your corvette onto it, and then use a trolley jack to lift the rear until the support legs drop down. it's easilyportable and stores flat. these are great for use where headroom is limited, as with the rafters of this garage.>>>
Locking
The safety locking mechanism is of paramount importance and is a feature you should pay extra attention to when deciding on a lift. Not only do you want a positive locking mechanism that engages automatically and requires a deliberate manual release to disengage it, you also want a mechanism that becomes active as soon as the lift starts to elevate. This is a particularly important point, since several lifts have locking mechanisms that don't engage until the lift is 18 inches or even 24 inches off the ground-having the lift fail and come crashing down on your legs from 18 inches is enough to permanently cripple you, so don't underestimate the importance of the locking system. You also want the locking system to be fail-safe, which means that even if the lift motor and/or hydraulics completely fail, the locks will hold the lift and your vehicle safely and stably in the elevated position indefinitely. Do not skimp here.
Two-posters like this one from Mohawk permit the suspension to be unsprung, and they are ideal for working on shocks, wheels, tires, brakes, and so on.>>>
Mounting
Some lifts require permanent mounting to the cement floor of your garage. Permanent mounting may be a necessity for some lift types (e.g., two-post models) or may afford additional stability. Lifts that don't require permanent mounting can be moved with the aid of caster kits, making them easy to relocate if required or desired.
Voltage
With the exception of the Kwiklift and other manually elevated or drive-on type devices, lifts are actuated by electric motors that either power hydraulic pumps or cable-and-pulley mechanisms. These electric motors are usually available in either 110- or 220-volt varieties, and the type of electrical service you have in your garage determines which variety you'll need.
2-Post Versus 4-Post
Another choice to be made is whether to go with a 2-post or a 4-post lift. Invariably, the 2-post lifts require permanent anchoring to a concrete floor and they have swing-out arms that make contact with the chassis of the vehicle just in back of the front tires and just ahead of the rears on each side. The 4-post lifts support the vehicle at all four corners and normally do not require permanent anchoring to the garage floor; these lifts usually can be moved about with the use of optional caster kits.
Drive-On/Frame-Contact
These names are fairly self-explanatory. Drive-on lifts have runways that you actually drive the vehicle onto, hence the name. Conversely, frame-contact lifts have four contact arms that make contact with the frame of the vehicle. The two varieties differ in their appeal, usefulness, and lifting approach. The drive-on lifts keep the suspension loaded since the weight of the vehicle is still resting on the tires, just as it does when on the ground; the frame-contact lifts allow the suspension to unload, since the wheels and tires are not supporting the vehicle. For any work that requires removal of the wheels and tires (e.g., replacing brakes, shocks, and so on), the frame-contact lifts are beneficial. They're also good for longterm vehicle storage since they prevent flat spots from developing on tires (which are not in contact with anything except the air). For tasks where it is desirable to have the suspension loaded, the drive-on units are the way to go. That's not to say that you can't do brake, shock, or wheel/ tire work on a drive-on lift. By using ancillary devices such as bottle jacks, you can still elevate the vehicle on a drive-on lift to unload the suspension.
Domestic Versus Imported
Without getting up on my soapbox, I make no bones about preferring American-made products over foreignmade imports, and I go out of my way to give the home-team players my business whenever possible. "Made in the U.S.A." should be important to anyone who's going to get underneath a lift with a 3,000-plus pound car on top of it! That being said, I would be remiss if I did not mention that a vast number of the lifts available are actually made in China, Korea, or other offshore sites and sold by various companies here stateside. Many of these companies will import bare-steel lifts from China, then either paint or powdercoat them, apply their own decals and/or nameplates, and sell them to the unwary consumer who thinks he's buying a quality American-made product when, in fact, this is not the case. Two cases in point are Direct-Lift (made in China) and Eagle (made in China). In a side-by-side comparison, these two lifts are absolutely identical. Both of these lifts use an inside plastic slider design, which means the only thing holding the deck to the legs of the unit is plastic. It's important to note this type of design has had collapses reported; hence you are forewarned here. Look for lifts that use all-steel components and, especially, steel slider designs.
Don't be shy about asking questions when shopping for a lift -if the company's sales literature or Web site does not answer your specific question, ask the company directly, either in person or via e-mail, and get a point-blank answer to your inquiry. If they beat around the bush, beware! Any reputable company purveying a quality product will be entirely upfront and will gladly answer your questions; in fact, they will be eager to show you what makes their products superior to the competition.
Warranty
Any quality-made product should be well-backed by its manufacturer, and this is very true of lifts. A good warranty will give you peace of mind on two counts: 1) if the manufacturer is willing to back it, that speaks well of their confidence in a well-made product; 2) if anything goes wrong with it -a part fails, a hose leaks, and so on -the warranty should cover the repair or replacement at no cost to you. Great products should have equally great warranties, and you shouldn't have to wait for a replacement part to be shipped from China or other far-off locales.
Accessories
Depending on the manufacturer, type, and model of the lift, various accessories can make your life easier and expand the usefulness of the lift. Some accessories you may wish to consider are drip pans, shallow-incline approach ramps, runway connector bridges, transmission-support stands, jackstands, wheel chocks, elevating oil-drain funnels, bottle jacks, and other such items.
Since there are so many different vendors of lifts and so many different models in a wide range of capacities and prices available, it really isn't possible or practical to list everything here. Please note that not all the sources listed are manufacturers, some are distributors; the American lift manufacturers are so noted. I wholeheartedly encourage you to contact these companies, check out their product offerings, and ask questions (starting with where the lift is manufactured) until you are thoroughly satisfied. As I mentioned earlier, this probably is going to be (or at least it should be) a once-in-a-lifetime purchase, so make sure that you're getting everything you expect with regard to quality, dependability, performance, value, and, most importantly, safety, when making your decision.

THE CERTIFICATION STICKER IS MANDATORY ON A DECENT LIFT[/color]
http://www.autolift.org/
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Lift Sources
* Affordable Automotive Equipment: http://www.afordableautomotiveequip.net
* Automotive Service Equipment: www. asedeals.com
* Backyard Buddy:www.backyardbuddy.com (made in U.S.A.)
* Carlifts.biz: http://www.carlifts.biz
* Direct-Lift: http://www.directlift.com
* Garage Equipment Supply: http://www.gesusa.com
* KwikLift: http://www.kwiklift.com (made in U.S.A.)
* Lifts Unlimited: http://www.liftsunlimited.com
* Mohawk Lifts: http://www.mohawklifts.com(made in U.S.A.)
* Revolution Lifts: http://www.revolutionlift.com
* Rotary Lift: http://www.rotarylift.com

DO YOUR EXTENSIVE RESEARCH BEFORE ORDERING FROM ANY SUPPLIER THERES A TON OF SCAM ARTISTS THAT TAKE MONEY BUT ONLY GIVE EXCUSES OR SHIP INFERIOR CRAPPY LIFTS
* SuperLifts.com: http://www.superlifts.com (made in U.S.A.) (lots of complaints I see on line with these guys )
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby mrmtr » January 18th, 2010, 11:40 pm

Well I have finally got my car lift in the shop. I have been looking for about a year now.I have read every article I could find, including the article written here by Grumpy.I knew before I read this article that I wanted a certified lift ,not a lift from China that wasn't certified. What I did find that most lift manufacture companies are now having their lifts built in China. Of the lifts I researched which included Rotary, Forward, Ben Pearson, Maverick, Ben Pack, Revolution, Quality, Ammco, and Challenger, I chose the Challenger CL10V3 which included 3 stage arms both front and back. The leading selling point that I liked about the lift I bought was it only needed 11 ft 8 inches to install. I had a the professionals install it and they had it up and finished in 2 hours. (2 guys) They knew each others move and worked together great. I had a 11 ft 10 1/2 inch ceiling height and it was close...real close. It is all ready to go but it was too late to really try it out so tomorrow I will lift some cars.I didn't know if my concrete was going to be ok but it turned out good having about 8 to 9 inches. Anyway for you who are shopping for a lift, look over the articles written here and buy a good lift ..one that has ALI on it and not ALA which basically means nothing. After seeing the guys put the lift in I would recommend you get a pro to install it. I know I could do it but they had all the equipment and there was no question on the skill they had . They were certified from Challenger.
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » January 19th, 2010, 12:04 am

congrats and enjoy your lift!
please post pictures
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby gdmclnh » May 10th, 2010, 12:23 pm

Grumpy, I've been investigating various two post lifts. I agree that off shore lifts are not generally a good idea. I've looked at the Pearson lifts like yours. I like the 10 AD model that Pearson sells that for about $600 less than the 9000 series. What is your opinion of this lift? I am a hobbyist, but I would want to be able to lift my 3/4 ton towing rig that weighs slightly over 6000 lbs. Capacity wise the 10 AD will do this. The ability to use it as a center or assymetrical lift is interesting.
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » May 10th, 2010, 4:05 pm

I have not used that particular lift, but Ive no reason to think it would be any less useful than my current lift which has so far operated flawlessly for several years


http://www.ben-pearson.com/10ad.shtml
Ben Pearson - Model 10AD Two Post
***
***
Specifications
PART # MODEL DESCRIPTION PRICE
90232 10AD 10,000 lb. 2 post with straight posts and asymmetrical arms.
This Design allows you to position vehicles to lift both in a straight and asymmetrical position. It's like having two lifts for the price of one. 2,595.00
Built Tough, Built to Last.

The 10AD from Ben Pearson.
Ben Pearson's 10AD Can Expand Your Service Bay Without Expanding Your Cost...
Every Shop is a little different and so is evry vehicle you service, that's why Ben Pearson created the 10AD two-post lift. This rugged lift gives you the flexibility to expand the services you can offer without expanding your service bay. The 10AD can lift in a symmetrical or asymmetrical mode, allowing you to work on just about any vehicle that comes in for service work.

When You Invest In Ben Pearson's 10AD Two Post Lift, It's like Getting 2 Lifts for the Price of One.
With 10,000 pounds of lifting capacity, two lifting modes and a heavy-duty lifting system, Ben Pearson's 10AD will deliver the power and reliability you've come to expect from a Ben Pearson lift. Want more Information? That's easy, just give us a call (1-800-436-1327) and let us explain feature by feature, what the best, most flexible and affordable lift you can buy.

Lift Specifications:

* Capacity - 10,000lbs
* Overall Height - 142"
* Overall Width (at Floor) - 137½"
* Drive Thru Clearance - 96"
* Lifting Height - 70¾ "
* Lifting Height with adaptors- 75¾”
* Lifting Time - 75 Seconds
* Shipping Weight - 1,605 lbs.

Lift Features:

* Dual cylinder direct pull lifting. No chains or roller bearings to wear out
* Single piece column. Continuous rolled steel column. No sheet metal
* Extra long carriage (44”) puts less stress on slider blocks
* Padded cut-off bar. Automatic electric override
* Two point lock release
* Free hardware
* Stackable truck adapters are standard (11⁄2”, 3” and 6”)
* Powder coat paint finish



two post lifts are generally more versatile as they usually provide far easier , less restricted access to suspension, exhaust and drive train, but they are a bit harder to get the car up because you need to position 4 arms on the frame rather than simply driving onto the lift, and a two post must be firmly anchored in the concrete floor during use

there ARE portable 2 post lifts

http://www.gesusa.com/Dannmar-MaxJax-Two-Post-Lift-p/1375659.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSUAXQOo ... r_embedded
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » June 6th, 2012, 3:11 pm

if you have pictures of your cars underside..while up on a 2 post or 4 post lift please post them, Ive had several people ask why I say a two post lift gives you more easy access to the drive train and suspension, but need pictures of cars up on both style lifts to show the difference.
theres no question a 4 post lift is easier to get the car up on, and for many things they are a great choice, but they also usually require a sliding bridge jack to access suspension, because a two post lift lifts the cars frame allowing the wheels to hang unsupported while a 4 post lift has the car supported on the tires and suspension making them less easily accessed, plus the two wide roll on supports a 4 post jack uses slightly limit access under the car

http://www.completehydraulic.com/lifts- ... lrbj6.html
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above typical 4 post designs, these tend to be far easier to get the car up on, but working on the suspension can be a P.I.T.A.


below TWO POST these tend to be far easier to get to the cars suspension components , but getting the car up on them can be a P.I.T.A.

Image
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IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: a car lift in your shop

Postby grumpyvette » December 13th, 2012, 7:25 pm

take the time and effort to do your research, on the company your dealing with before you spend money and use a credit card not a check so you have some recourse if they never ship the product, theres several company's that either take a deposit and never ship the lift or ship a lift that is not the lift they advertize
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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