Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way



Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby grumpyvette » June 23rd, 2014, 3:47 pm

I was over helping bob today, for awhile and he was replacing the head gasket on a buddies car.
well once the old head, and head gasket was removed there was a bunch of old gasket sealer left on the block and head surface, and BOB reached for a rotary brush on a 1/2" chuck drill which I'm certain has been done by thousands of guys, in the past, but its a darn good way to screw up the gasket sealing surface.
(yes I know its been done thousands of times but its also resulted in dozens of guys with unexplained head gasket failures)
the problem is that its absolutely impossible to remove the old stuck on gasket material with a drill and rotary wire brush without doing at least some minor damage to the sealing surface and its all too easy to do damage that can cause head gaskets to leak
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the correct route is to spray the surface down with a gasket solvent spray, let it sit 15 minutes, re-spray , it may take two or even three coats of solvent but the residue will tend to wipe off with minimal force once soft and partly dissolved and then use a 6 inch wide (minimum ) , under gaskets but over the bores without tipping a sharp edge, of the thin flexible blade edge into a bore,while using minimal pressure , THIS IS EXTREMELY CRITICAL ON ALUMINUM HEAD GASKET SURFACES,
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held almost parallel to the surface, the flex blade used with minimal pressure is used to loosen the old gasket residue, by slicing the loose gooey, mostly solvent soaked and mostly dissolved residue off the machined surface then wipe off the surface with a rag soaked in acetone. to remove any remaining residue, that way the mating surface is less likely to get gouged
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Item number :
CRC-03017
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using a decent shop vacuum while you remove gaskets tends to greatly reduce the chance or odd debris getting into places you don,t want or need that crap to get into
THIS IS THE ONE I PURCHASED AND I RECOMMEND IT, remember to change filter elements frequently and a couple quarts of water and a couple drops of dawn dish washing liquid in the water traps a great deal of dust in the lower body before it gets to the filter
http://www.homedepot.com/p/RIDGID-16-Ga ... 5yc1vZbv79
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if you want to be sure you get all the metallic trash removed,removing gaskets and using a thread tap to clean bolt holes followed by a solvent spray wash and a long tip high pressure air nozzle blowing the passages dry and clear, of solvent and clear of debris, along with the ling spray nozzle ,high pressure air, solvent and the vacuum is a hard combo to beat
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VERIFY THE BLOCK DECKS NOT WARPED
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A CARPENTERS SQUARE , A BRIGHT LIGHT AND FEELER GAUGES CAN BE USED TO CHECK IF THE BLOCK DECK OR CYLINDER HEAD MATING SURFACE IS SQUARE AND NOT WARPED
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heres a video on checking heads for warpage
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCuGElPUsWc


HERES A VIDEO THAT SHOULD BE TITLED
"HOW TO SCREW UP A BLOCKS GASKET SURFACE"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KABhydC0Q_o
HONESTLY HE IS REALLY DOING THE JOB BADLY, BUT IF YOUR NOT KNOWLEDGEABLE< HOW WOULD YOU KNOW?

Larry Carley wrote:Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way
Engine dis-assembly is a dirty, greasy, time-consuming job, so any shortcut that makes the work go faster is a good idea, right? Maybe not if the short cut ends up damaging parts or creating more work for you in the long run.
The practice we’re talking about here is using an abrasive pad in a drill to grind off gasket residue that may be stuck to the heads or block. The abrasive will certainly whiz the gasket debris right off, but it can also whiz off metal leaving a shallow depression, a dig or a groove that may create a sealing problem when the engine is put back together.

Another reason not to use an abrasive disk to grind off or clean a surface is that it generates a lot of dust. Some gasket fibers may be hazardous to breathe. A dust mask can protect your lungs, but the residue can end up in other places where it may cause problems later (like in the cylinders, intake ports, oil or coolant passages).

The best way to remove gaskets is with a sharp scraper and/or a can of aerosol chemical gasket remover. Spraying the gaskets with a chemical remover eliminates hard scraping and the risk of scratching or gouging the surface, especially on soft aluminum heads and blocks. The chemical does most of the work by softening the gaskets. The residue can then be easily scraped off the surface.

One mistake to avoid here is using the wrong tool to scrape off the gaskets. An old screw driver is not a gasket remover. Nor is a putty knife. A gasket scraper is the right tool to use because it has a sharp, beveled edge that gets under and lifts the old gasket from the surface. Just make sure the scraper is sharp (it should be sharp enough to cut paper).

The trick to using a gasket scraper correctly is to scrape at an angle that is almost parallel to the surface. By keeping the angle small, the tip of the scraper will slip under the gasket and shear it away from the surface without digging in. If you try to use it like a chisel, you’ll probably end up gouging the surface and damaging the surface. Also, hold the scraper so you push it forward (away from you) as you scrape. This way, if the tool slips it won’t gouge you.


viewtopic.php?f=52&t=4081&p=10861#p10861

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=3379&p=8946&hilit=shop+vacuum#p8946

viewtopic.php?f=44&t=700&p=43768&hilit=head+gasket+bore#p43768

viewtopic.php?f=32&t=10376&p=42845&hilit=head+gasket+bore#p42845

viewtopic.php?f=52&t=4403&p=38976&hilit=head+gasket+bore#p38976
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
grumpyvette

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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby grumpyvette » June 26th, 2014, 3:26 pm

I got asked if a carpenters square is a decent strait edge , and if it can be used to check a cylinder head, well its not nearly as accurate as a machined checking bar but I'd bet most guys have never even seen one, or bought one, hell most guys don,t even know theres checking standards for machinist mics , thats one reason I try to post links as it helps guys understand what is being done and why
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I own a milling machine and lots of machinist tooling , but Id bet 90% of the people reading this know what a carpenters square IS but less than 20% know what things like
machinist blue , and a dial indicator, feeler gauges ,machined strait edge, are or how to use those, or have ever checked a head for warpage.
I also cringe at the total lack of knowledge about what some machining processes involve and blind trust many guys have in local machine shops. Ive had shops try and charge me for jobs they could not possibly have done with the machinery they have on hand!
I,m SO glad I purchased both my welders and a decent mill before I retired, because I sure could never afford those tools now... in fact I just for grins looked at the current cost of a similar mill and see the cost is at least 75% higher than it was back 10-15 years ago when I purchased most of my larger machine tools,
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http://www.grizzly.com/outlet/Shop-Fox- ... 49-/T20828

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCuGElPUsWc

viewtopic.php?f=53&t=4630&p=39788&hilit=bore+gauge#p39788

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=10363&p=43806&hilit=plastigauge#p43806

viewtopic.php?f=53&t=10213&p=40551&hilit=plastigauge#p40551

viewtopic.php?f=53&t=2726&p=26440&hilit=plastigauge#p26440

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=111&p=25954&hilit=plastigauge#p25954
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby DorianL » June 27th, 2014, 12:37 am

I would have to say at the end of this one…. OOOPS!!!!!!
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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby grumpyvette » June 27th, 2014, 10:33 am

DorianL wrote:I would have to say at the end of this one…. OOOPS!!!!!!



YOUR HARDLY ALONE AND ID BE LYING IF I SAID ID NEVER DONE IT IN THE PAST THE WRONG WAY, BUT YOU EVENTUALLY LEARN THERES A REASON YOU DO THINGS A CERTAIN WAY, AND UNFORTUNATELY MANY TIMES YOU LEARN BY SCREWING UP EXPENSIVE PARTS :roll: :oops:
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby philly » June 27th, 2014, 6:05 pm

guilty :oops:
-phil

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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby Indycars » June 27th, 2014, 6:49 pm

philly wrote:guilty :oops:


NOOOOO ...... Say it ain't true !!!

LOL, you got to respect someone when they will admit the truth about
something they have done !!!

You crack me up sometimes !!! :lol:

Rick
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- Check Out My Dart SHP Engine Project: viewtopic.php?f=69&t=3814
- Need a Dynamic Compression Ratio Calculator: viewtopic.php?f=99&t=4458
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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby philly » June 28th, 2014, 7:10 am

if you ever happen across the oil pan for a datsun L motor you'll understand why the wire wheel is the only practical solution. however iver never wire brushed a block,head, or manifold surface... may have used sandpaper tho!
-phil

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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby Indycars » June 28th, 2014, 9:24 am


OK, that makes me feel better now!

Rick
Too much is just enough!!!

- Check Out My Dart SHP Engine Project: viewtopic.php?f=69&t=3814
- Need a Dynamic Compression Ratio Calculator: viewtopic.php?f=99&t=4458
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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby grumpyvette » June 28th, 2014, 9:29 am

oil pan to block surfaces, and valve cover gaskets, t-stat gaskets, front timing cover gaskets , are far less critical especially with the newer synthetic one piece gaskets

viewtopic.php?f=54&t=115&p=142&hilit=synthetic+gasket#p142
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby philly » June 28th, 2014, 1:59 pm

i started using hi temp silicone for certain surfaces like the L series oil pan and where gaskets are NLA or atleast not readily available

http://www.permatex.com/products-2/prod ... 194-detail

82194.jpg
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-phil

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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby philly » June 28th, 2014, 2:01 pm

if you apply it correctly its very forgiving of uneven or gouged surfaces, you cant just wad the stuff on there thick and all willy-nilly
-phil

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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby 87vette81big » June 28th, 2014, 4:35 pm

philly wrote:i started using hi temp silicone for certain surfaces like the L series oil pan and where gaskets are NLA or atleast not readily available

http://www.permatex.com/products-2/prod ... 194-detail

82194.jpg

That's what I use for RTV Silicone 99% of the time Phil.
Ultra Grey. Stuff is the Best.
I use Ultra Copper still on occasion too.
Makes a great Header gasket subsitute that will not blow out ever on a Hotrod or Racecar.
Use on Racecars Phil. Because they dont care about Looks.
Just go fast, No Header leaks & Win a must
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Re: Removing Gaskets The Wrong Way

Postby philly » June 28th, 2014, 11:13 pm

87vette81big wrote:
philly wrote:i started using hi temp silicone for certain surfaces like the L series oil pan and where gaskets are NLA or atleast not readily available

http://www.permatex.com/products-2/prod ... 194-detail

82194.jpg

That's what I use for RTV Silicone 99% of the time Phil.
Ultra Grey. Stuff is the Best.
I use Ultra Copper still on occasion too.
Makes a great Header gasket subsitute that will not blow out ever on a Hotrod or Racecar.
Use on Racecars Phil. Because they dont care about Looks.
Just go fast, No Header leaks & Win a must


yep ive used the copper spray on a head gasket and the copper goop on exhaust too. good stuff!
-phil

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