should you block off the oil filter bye-pass?



should you block off the oil filter bye-pass?

Postby grumpyvette » September 25th, 2008, 12:25 pm

SOME OLDER BUILDERS ARE UNDER THE IMPRESSION THAT FORCING ALL THE OIL FLOW THRU THE FILTER ELEMENT IS A GOOD IDEA,..YOU CAN,T compress oil, THE OIL PUMP, PUSHES A SET SWEEP VOLUME DICTATED BY THE GEAR AND PUMP SIZE AND RPM LEVEL, .most have not thought it thru carefully, 90% of the guys use the standard disposable filters with those thin synthetic or paper elements, the bye pass is there for a reason, and in my opinion its a good idea to leave it functional, when oil is cold or when theres a VERY rapid change in rpms the bye-pass tends to keep the pressure spikes that result, from rupturing the filter element, a bit of unfiltered oil momentarily is better than having a filter element rupture,internally as your very unlikely to know that its failed and much of the oil is now unfiltered as a result, or pull loose from its glued seams due to a pressure spike, resulting in a constant flow of partly unfiltered oil
a lot of guys used to do that mod, thinking it would be beneficial to force all oil thru the filter, now in theory it helps, but I have yet to see any real proof its all that helpful to engine durability, remember any oil goes thru the pump before it reaches the oil filter and theres always oil being thrown off the crank and windage carries some oil around with the crank, before its dropped into the sump so a windage trays helpful, if small debris gets into the oil pump it will damage the gears or clog the oil pump pick-up screen well before the oil filter is ever going to see that debris.
thats one reason I think magnets are useful also as they trap metallic crap most likely to cause damage.

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READ THESE THREADS
viewtopic.php?f=54&t=120

viewtopic.php?f=54&t=2187

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viewtopic.php?f=54&t=2187

viewtopic.php?f=54&t=3536

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viewtopic.php?f=54&t=3834

viewtopic.php?f=54&t=52

http://people.msoe.edu/~yoderw/oilfilte ... study.html
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: should you block off the oil filter bye-pass?

Postby grumpyvette » October 9th, 2008, 2:53 pm

BTW on the high voluum pump versus the standard pump, what Im saying is basically this
if you push the oil at a low enough pressure and voluum accross the bearing surfaces the limited , stock oil voluum ,compared to the higher , voluum pumped by the aftermarket pumps, passing over the surface will ,pick up a higher heat transfer per oil voluum in contact with the bearing surfaces due to its longer contact time.
that poses three minor potential problems that might be major potential problem depending on the temp. range and oil quality (mineral versus synthetic)

(1)as the oil voluum passing over the bearing surface heats up it can absorb a lower percentage of the bearings heat

(2)as oil heats up it breaks down and by the time mineral base oils hit 260 degrees they have lost significant lubrication

(3)oil picks up and carries micro trash (carbon,acids, metalic dust,etc.) that can embed in the bearing surfaces, a slightly higher pressure and voluum flowing accross the bearing surfaces TENDs to keep them cleaner because the FILTERED oil PUSHED OVER THE BEARING SURFACES tends to be run through the FILTER more often
so if your pushing 20% more oil at 10% greater pressure accross the bearings the oil will tend heat slower,have a greater time in the cooling off cycle and stabilize at a lower total heat absorbsion level.

what most of the guys that tell you a stock pump is all youll ever need FORGET to TELL you is that
the high voluum pumps pump oil to the bearings faster at startup, helping to prevent wear, pump ONLY what the engines CLEARANCES ALLOW, have a more constant pressure level, and they also don,t seem to understand that the hydrolic lifters in most engines have internal valves that limit the oil flow voluum, in almost every case where someome says the valve covers fill up at high RPMs, your talking to someone whos just repeating something they heard, or someone whos FAILED tO CORRECTLY PREP THE BLOCK AND/OR USE A WINDAGE SCREEN not someone thats actually tested the engine to see if what they are talking about is true

read this part of that big post above

now what does quite frequently happen is that the guys installing a high volume oil pump just swap out the standard pump, reinstall the stock or simular pick-up and bolt on the pan with the pick-up in the stock possition on the oil pump. the stock pick-up is mounted about 3/8" off the pan bottom,the high volume pump is normally equiped with impeller gears about .3 inches longer than stock, the high volume pump body is that much lower in the pan, resultting in the pick-up being only about 1/8" from the pan bottom. the result is that on a normal chevy oil pump pick-up this leave a space of about 1/8" x 2.5" for oil to flow into the pump. at low rpms this works but as the rpms climb the pick-up that can,t get any oil to pump cavitates as it spins and fails to pump oil, result oil pressure drops untill rpms are lowered no matter how much oil is over the pick-up............ valve covers never get and hold more than about 1/3 to 2/3 of a quart each even at 8000 rpm (high speed photography by SMOKEY YUNICK doing stock car engine research with clear plastic valve covers prove that

BTW WHILE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT OIL SYSTEMS, just some info, see these remote adapters, a fairly comon reason people install high voluum pumps is to use these remote adapters

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IVE RARELY found these VERTICAL adapters

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for remote mount oil filters as useful as the horizontal design adapters

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you can mount the filter almost any place its easily accessed
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viewtopic.php?f=54&t=4904

well a fairly common way to kill an engine is to INCORRECTLY install one of these remote filter adapter kits,
look at the top picture and keep in mind that those two connecting hoses COULD be flipped as to what end(in/out ) on the remote filters gets hooked to the bypass adapter (IN/OUT) ports, hook it up correctly and everything works just fine! but swap the two hoses on only one end and YOUR OIL PUMP tries to push OIL PAST the ANTI-DRAINBACK VALVES on the oil filters,(and most of the time is marginally successfull in that a trickle of oil does get to the bearings and rocker arms at idle) now at idle youll still get good oil pressure (about 15 lbs) but rev the engine and the highly restricted oil flow pressure goes up very slowly but the oil VOLUUM getting into the block is so low youll spin a bearing in about the first 20 minutes ( [color:"red"] and 99% of the time the guy that does this blames the guy who built his engine for putting it togeather WRONG when in fact the engine could have been PERFECT but with no oil reaching the bearings under load the engine is history within at best about an hours running time! [/color]

BTW HERES AN IMPORTANT TIP, IF YOUR INSTALLING A REMOTE OIL COOLER,IT is really common for guys to use lines that are far to small, that restrict flow oil flow or select a transmission or oil cooler that has to small of internal passages, shop carefully you want a MINIMUM of 1/2, or AN8 line size and 5/8" or AN10 is BETTER
think about it, your measuring the oil pressure in most cases AFTER its been thru the cooler and returned to the oil passages in the block, oil leaves the oil pump and its routed to the oil filter where the oil filter adapter routes it thru the oil cooler and back to the adapter then into the block, your measuring the restricted oil flow after its returned to the block, if the lines or cooler passages restrict oil flow its potentially a problem for lubrication of the moving parts if pressure or oil volumes reduced
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IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: should you block off the oil filter bye-pass?

Postby grumpyvette » October 9th, 2008, 7:07 pm

when you do get the filter mount adapter do some serious thinking about both access, heat and where the oils likely to spill as the filters swapped out, one of my less intelligent friends , mounted his with the filters facing strait up rather than hanging down...easy access, never thinking thru the obvious flaw that spinning off a hot and full oil filter full of old oil results in it emptying all over the place!

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetai ... toview=sku
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also keep in mind the designed dirrection of oil flow,some adapters and some the filters have anti drainback valves that will starve the engine of oil flow if you get stupid & sloppy and get the lines reversed, they still flow SOME oil but not hardly enought to prevent bearing damage if the lines are reversed, check BOTH the block adapter and filter mount adapter ,ID suggest a 1/2" inside dia. as a minimum hose size to and from the cooler or filters,

your correct! a 3/8" inside line size is marginal too useless depending on what percentage of the oil is routed thru the coolers or remote filters, a 1/2" inside dia, line would be in my opinion the minimum that should be considered.
my trans cooler uses a 3/8" line , my oil cooler used to run a 1/2" but I found that the oil cooler was not necessary once I installed the trans cooler and 10 qt baffled oil pan on the car
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: should you block off the oil filter bye-pass?

Postby grumpyvette » October 10th, 2008, 6:03 pm

IF YOUR OIL TEMPS SPIKE UP INTO THE 240 F range under hard acceleration,that's expected and normal if your not running both a large capacity baffled oil pan AND a cooler with an electric powered fan, as it takes time for a non-fan equipped or small cooler to dissipate the oils heat,
BTW if you have a sudden drop in oil pressure on any engine with no other symptoms, you might want to replace the oil filter and check oil levels before you panic as its not uncommon for some brands of oil filters to fail internally

I used to run this dual cooler

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=PRM%2D13318&N=700+400006+115&autoview=sku
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but I found this transmission cooler alone was better

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=PRM%2D12318&N=700+115&autoview=sku
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as the oil temp was not a problem, but the trans temp was!

IVE always preferred the BYE_PASS versions as I felt dirty oil is preferable to NO OIL,which is what you get if the filter gets clogged with assembly lube or blows a seal ring with the non-bypass versions and not wanting to wait for the engine to reach operational temperatures which while not truly mandatory with a non- bypass adapter its a good idea to at least allow the oil to get warm before driving to keep the filters from excessive pressures

bypass style
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SES-3-60-08-900/
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non-bypass style

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CTR-22-570/
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remote filter style
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MOR-23683/
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IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
grumpyvette

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Re: should you block off the oil filter bye-pass?

Postby grumpyvette » October 3rd, 2009, 8:38 am

its refreshing to see someone think thru the process, before they start routing the hoses for the remote oil filter and before having problems with the oil transfer hose route and hot headers , and locating the filter where its fairly easy to gain access.
Id still have not blocked off the bye-pass but as long as you as careful to keep the rpms low until the oil reaches about 200f you should be ok, either way.
congrats on taking the time and effort to de-burr the block, while its not all that difficult few people bother, and it does make a difference in the rate of oil drain back, to the sump.
did you seal the interior lifter gallery and crank case walls block surface with a good smooth hard surface , high heat engine paint, after totally cleaning and degrease the block and after running a rifle bore cleaning bore brush thru the oil passages? to lock in micro debris in the block?

many guys use either VHT engine paint or GYPTAL which is designed more for electrical motors but it works just fine, and if youve de -greased the block before application, GYPTAL leaves a GLASS LIKE smooth surface that won,t come off, the VHT is easier to locate but its slightly less smooth
many engine shops have ovens and bead blasters to clean blocks , but a high pressure water jet from a pressure washer like many guys own or the local self service car wash pressure washer can do a decent job if you prep the block with grease solvents and a stiff metal brush several times carefully first
fauxrs2 posted this picture

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http://www.glyptal.com/Glyptal_Product_Data_Sheets.htm

http://www.duplicolor.com/products/engine.html

http://www.speedunleashed.com/vht-paint ... namel.html

if you want a remote mount oil filter these parts will get you a good start

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CTR-22-592/

Image

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRD-1222/

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it should be rather obvious that a decent oil cooler, on your cars lube system and on your cars transmission,that keeps the transmission fluid temps in the ideal temperature range will tend to maintain the more consistent and lower oil temperature ranges both your engine and transmission will require to last under harsh operating conditions. it should be equally obvious that a well designed oil pan and windage screen that will help maintain a consistent supply of that oil to the engine and if possible a deeper aluminum transmission pan that allows you to increase the volume of transmission fluid will help maintain those consistent temps., there are several good dual path coolers available but if you've got the room two separate 6 pass coolers with 3/8" npf fittings and matching lines would be ideal.


Ive been using this recently on my transmission, as my 10 qt custom oil pan seems to provide adequate oil cooling by it self

Image
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PRM-12318/

heres a similar dual trans fluid & separate engine oil cooler

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http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PRM-13311/?rtype=10
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: should you block off the oil filter bye-pass?

Postby guysmontess » October 3rd, 2009, 1:47 pm

After losing my first roller cam due to a lifter exploding and ruining the bearings & oil pump,I decided that I wanted the oil filtered all the time.But I did take precautions to insure against cold starts,and I also take it easy untill warmed up.I didnt paint or seal the lifter valley and walls with anything,but I did spend considerable time on polishing that area.It was very carefully cleaned before assembly,my buddy that helped me is a clean freak,and he made sure that I did everything properly.
Guy
1986 Monte Carlo SS 468 Big Block,UDHarold Custom Solid Roller Cam,.668 Lift,243/249 Dur. @ 0.050,Isky EZ Roll Lifters,Manton Pushrods,Jesel Rockers,Doug Nash 4+1 5 speed,Hurst Inline Shifter,Ford 9 Inch w/3.00:1 gear
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Re: should you block off the oil filter bye-pass?

Postby grumpyvette » May 31st, 2011, 10:46 am

lots of guys add oil coolers and or dual remote mount oil filters to add volume and give the oil more time to cool before its pumped back into hot engine parts,
IF and when you do get the filter mount adapter do some serious thinking about both access, heat and where the oils likely to spill as the filters swapped out, one of my less intelligent friends , mounted his with the filters facing strait up rather than hanging down...easy access, never thinking thru the obvious flaw that spinning off a hot and full oil filter full of old oil results in it emptying all over the place!
Image
Image
Image
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=TRD%2D1222&N=700+115&autoview=sku
Image

also keep in mind the designed direction of oil flow,some adapters and some the filters have anti drain back valves that will starve the engine of oil flow if you get stupid & sloppy and get the lines reversed, they still flow SOME oil but not hardly enough to prevent bearing damage if the lines are reversed, check BOTH the block adapter and filter mount adapter
Image
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
grumpyvette

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Joined: September 14th, 2008, 1:40 pm
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