Oil Pan gasket - still small leak



Oil Pan gasket - still small leak

Postby TigerVette » April 27th, 2010, 2:55 pm

Grumpy

Still struggling on getting the perfect seal on my C4 sbc - new motor, new oil pan and using a fel-pro 1-piece gasket similar to the one below.

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The slight leak occurs on the front seal and the very bottom (middle) which happens to be the further point from the holding torque of the bolts. Not sure what I'm encountering. Gasket thickness issue?
READ THIS ALSO
viewtopic.php?f=54&t=206&p=390#p390

May be I'm torquing too hard and the gasket is being pulled inward a hair? The bolts are installed firm but I didn't feel like I went overboard with it. Everything has gone together fairly smooth and appeared like a strong seal. Hard to tell now. But I have the balancer and some accessories apart and can feel/see the slight leak again. Could I just back the front bolts out a bit, see if the gasket comes forward any?

Thought? Suggestions?
TigerVette

 
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Re: Oil Pan gasket - still small leak

Postby grumpyvette » April 27th, 2010, 3:39 pm

viewtopic.php?f=54&t=206&p=390&hilit=+seal+thick+pan#p390
theres two common gasket thickness measurements,Put a straight edge across the front of the oil pan and measure down to the lowest part of where the seal rests directly centered under the crank,the distance from the strait edge to the lower front oil pan is the measurement you need,. It's the oil pan that determines thick or thin seal, not the timing cover.

2-1/4" = thin seal
2-3/8" = thick seal


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sources for oil leaks
Oil filter not tight
Oil drain plug seal bad
Oil cooler fitting loose
Faulty oil pressure switch
leaking valve cover gaskets
Oil pan gasket bad, or installed incorrectly
Rear seal failure, or installed incorrectly
Front seal bad,worn, or installed incorrectly
loose dip stick or installed incorrectly
rear cam freeze plug loose or installed incorrectly
rear oil passages plugs loose or installed incorrectly
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youll want to leave the timing cover alignment studs sticking out of the block about 5/16"



don,t forget that theres a front crank seal
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viewtopic.php?f=51&t=1718&p=11956&hilit=front+seal#p11956

http://www.federalmogul.com/en/Aftermar ... rMainSeal/

and rear crank seal that have zero to do with the oil pan gasket and those can also leak oil

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don,t forget a very thin line of sealant under the main cap/block bearing surface or you may have a very slow oil drip from what you think is the rear main seal but its really seeping under the main cap
viewtopic.php?f=54&t=473
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reading thru this thread may help,
theres TWO different front seal thicknesses, if you, select and install the wrong one
or install it incorrectly it leaks

and a bolt thats required to , be threaded into the block to seal oil into the crank case
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viewtopic.php?f=51&t=1718&p=4257&hilit=+rear+seal#p4257
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viewtopic.php?f=54&t=2725&p=7076&hilit=rear+seal#p7076


rear seals come in, rubber, silicon rubber,.Fluoroelastomer, and Viton they all work if properly installed but VITOR usually lasts the longest

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FEL-BS118291/.. rubber

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FEL-2909/... Fluoroelastomer,

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FEL-2900/... Silicone

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FEL-2918/..viton


you might want to Use with P/N 12553058 RH and P/N 12553059 LH oil pan reinforcement plates to distribute the bolt stress on the oil pan rail for 1985 and earlier oil pansP/N 14088501 (LH) and P/N 14088502 (RH).1986 and newer
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: Oil Pan gasket - still small leak

Postby TigerVette » April 27th, 2010, 4:28 pm

Great thread, plenty of advise to get me straightened out.

May be another week or two until I get it ironed out, but I will post an update.

Thank you!
TigerVette

 
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Re: Oil Pan gasket - still small leak

Postby TigerVette » May 15th, 2010, 2:37 pm

Well, the pan has been reinstalled. Went smooth and visually there's a strong bite on the front seal.

The Fel-Pro PN1881 (1980-85 thick front seal RH dipstick) is a much better fit, compared to the universal Fel-Pro I had from the store. Both side rails of the gasket have metal inserts gave a much better feel when installing the bolts, as well as more consistent fitment.

I also switched to a solid aluminum timing cover after reading numerous complaints on the poor fitment of generic chrome covers. A huge difference in the timing cover tab that seals with the oil pan. Much stronger with the aluminum, not tack welded on like the generic chrome. Very beefy construction, glad I replaced this early on.

I'm letting everything set over night, then will recheck the bolts tomorrow and refill the pan. More later
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Re: Oil Pan gasket - still small leak

Postby grumpyvette » February 2nd, 2011, 5:33 am

posted bye C Man

I hope my leasons learned will may help someone else.
I had a massive oil leak at the front of the engine that steadly got worse over the past 6 months. When it developed in a big puddle in the garage it was time to take action. From reading some of Grumppy's threads, I followed his advise and luckly my problem was one of the first on his list, oil pan gasket. If you don't have Service Manuals, my next purchase, the Chilton's Manual for 1993-1997 was a great help. If I would have followed my Haynes Manual, I would have droped the engine when it said to remove the crossmember braces. That would have been a mess. Here's a quick list that I haven't see on other threads.
1) I used the incramental jack up method that I got from these threads and safely got the front end up about 2 1/2 feet without tearing anything up.
2) Remove starter. Can be manuvered around the tranny cooling lines without removing them. It's preatty tuff getting back in though.
3) Remove oil filter assemby. I wanted to replace that gasket too but I couldn't get the old one out.
4) Remove bolts to the fly wheel cover but you can't remove it without removing the left catalytic converter. I lossen CC but I couldn't get it out. Oil pan can be remove with the flywheel cover loose though.
5) I used the one piece Fel-Pro gasket. This seamed a lot thicker the the original gasket I took out. The holding clips are no good because the oil pan can out be manuvered between the front of the engine block and the crossmembers when using them. I put the new gasket in place on engine block with the oil pan nuts and screws finger thight and used a small bead of grey silicone RTV at the front and back main-seal areas just keep the gasket in place, but I didn't put any on the engine block mateing surfaces. After a 24 hour cure, I removed the oil pan nuts and screws and easily put the oil pan back in place.
6) I put everything back together in reverse order, thighting to troq specs as I went.

I did try to remove the dip stick tube, which would have help in getting the pan back on, but I couldn't get it out and figured I would have ended up bending or breaking it trying to. After reading the threads about replacing those, I didn't want to go there. I've been driving a couple of miles each day for a week and haven't had any problems since. The oil leak is gone. These threads are great and I grabbed a lot of info from different ones. Thanks to all.
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
grumpyvette

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Re: Oil Pan gasket - still small leak

Postby grumpyvette » February 2nd, 2011, 5:33 am

IM glad someone actually reads that stuff I post
glad it all worked out well
I hope you supported the car safely, some of you might think Im old fashion but some repairs (even thou I own a LIFT) are easier to do with 4 12 ton jack stands and a creeper

related useful threads
viewtopic.php?f=27&t=98

viewtopic.php?f=59&t=3178&p=8465&hilit=creeper#p8465

viewtopic.php?f=80&t=1024&p=8948&hilit=ramps#p8948

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if you don,t have a lift,and use a mechanics creeper do yourself a HUGE FAVOR and buy and use four of these jack stands, on a solid concrete floor


http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=34924

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=26

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=1718

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=2725&p=7076&hilit=synthetic+gasket#p7076

http://forum.grumpysperformance.com/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=206&p=1154&hilit=+synthetic+gasket#p1154
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
grumpyvette

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Posts: 14105
Joined: September 14th, 2008, 1:40 pm
Location: florida


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