building a custom wet sump oil pan



Re: building a custom wet sump oil pan

Postby 87vette81big » July 16th, 2014, 9:47 pm

I am going to order & Purchase my 50 MM Ammo Can & Super Fat 50 SAW Box Ammo can This Friday Grumpy.
Puchased last of small items for 425 Olds.
Milodon Street Stip Olds Oil Pump Pickup coming.
Milodon 4130 Chrome Moly Olds Oil pump driveshaft came in today.
Have another 1965-69 Pontiac Full Length windage trar coming. $25 fleabay again.
Prices are getting nuts. Most want $200 for That used Poncho windage tray.
No one looking again. Bought it cheap.
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Re: building a custom wet sump oil pan

Postby grumpyvette » July 17th, 2014, 8:20 am

do a great deal of careful measuring, and think,things thru, well before you start cutting and fitting actual material. 99% of the potential problems can be avoided if you do a few hours of careful measuring and thinking before you start cutting and welding and poster board and duct tape are far easier to use as test patterns and useful for trial and error fitting than metal. remember the internal pan depth can be no shallower than the oil pump extends below the block plus a about 1/4"
you can use sharp scissors and duct tape to test fabricate and "WELD" and then modify your ideas with far less wasted effort and expense, before the METAL oil pan and ammo cans start to get cut.

and ID highly advise having the car up on jack stands or a lift so you can constantly go back and test fit to make sure what your envisioning and what your actually building has some similarity with reality, and don,t forget to swing the steering wheel lock to lock to check suspension clearance, and have the headers , and oil filter and starter,installed
( just saying because Ive been down that road dozens of times)

PLEASE TAKE AND POST A FEW PICTURES AS YOU PROGRESS WITH THE PROJECT
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: building a custom wet sump oil pan

Postby 87vette81big » July 17th, 2014, 10:45 am

I will check Grumpy.
Its Rear Steering Parallel Steering linkage .
Engine bay is huge so I can keep it simple and big sump.
May use a tube through design for a few pan bolts.

I can have the 403 olds out in 1 hour myself.
Hood stays on.
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Re: building a custom wet sump oil pan

Postby grumpyvette » July 19th, 2014, 11:14 am

I ran across these first two pictures, on a different site and felt they could be useful as a teaching aid,
the owner obviously has installed a slosh baffle gate in the lower sump and the rear area has what appears to be a partial windage screen, obviously this will function better than if he had not taken any effort and simply installed a open oil pan sump like most cars engines come with, but he stopped well short of the ideal oil control level that could have been reached.
I think the screening must have been having a clearance issue in the forward area of the oil pan under the forward four cylinders from the look of the way the screen was cut, now assuming there was room and no suspension or cross member prevented it a deeper pan or modifying the current oil pan seems like an option, a solid sheet metal horizontal upper sump slosh baffle should have extended back under the windage screen , and over the oil pan sump at the level of the upper oil pan floor ,well past the location of the swinging oil gate , to prevent oil from rushing forward under hard braking, not having the upper plate in place defeats a great deal of the purpose of having the lower slosh gate
(similar to the third picture)
KEEP IN MIND THERES SEVERAL THINGS GOING ON IN A PROPERLY DESIGNED OIL PAN
THE MAIN OBJECT IS TO MAINTAIN A CONSTANT DEPENDABLE SUPPLY OF OIL OVER THE OIL PUMP PICK UP, and REDUCE THE RESISTANCE THE SPINNING CRANK SEES PUSHING RETURNING OIL AROUND IN THE CRANK CASE
(1)the upper full length slosh plate,over the baffles and gates direct oil to the oil pump
(2)the screen allows oil to flow along the upper surface of the slosh plate back to the sump without the spinning crank assembly picking it up and circulating it in the crank case
(3)the screen shears off oil flow passing over its surface and directs oil into protected routes back to the sump

Image
Image

the area behind the screen but over the sump forms a semi-protected path for oil flow forced by the spinning crank assembly to easily travel back to the sump. yet prevents oil slosh under hard braking
Image
a windage screen like these mounted over the slosh plate adds a good deal more efficiency
Image
Image
Image

HERES A DIFFERENT MANUFACTURERS OIL PAN,the oil pan below LACKS a SLOSH PLATE over the sump area and has very limited windage protection of the oil in the sump as a result, so even though it may look impressive it will likely not prevent oil windage effectively or force oil back into the sump or protect and trap oil under high g-loads during cornering or braking

Image
Image
Image
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: building a custom wet sump oil pan

Postby 87vette81big » July 19th, 2014, 1:26 pm

See what I can build Grumpy.
$ is tight for all.
Olds 425 is not going to make 900-1000 Hp.
400-425 Target on 87 octane pee water is my goal.
Torque is really more important. 4,200 #'s to move.
Guaranteed at least 360 HP & 470 FT/lbs stock.
More than the 1973 & 74 Pontiac SD 455 Had and was the fastest production pump gas engine built from the muscle car era. A few guys got the SD 455 Birds in 11's with stock long block & JR Long tube headers.
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Re: building a custom wet sump oil pan

Postby grumpyvette » July 22nd, 2014, 11:43 am

if you ever wondered what swapping to a decent baffled oil pan and windage tray combos worth heres one example, I found posted of the results on a dyno
http://www.jegs.com/i/Milodon/697/31188 ... 1802315845
Image

standard oil pan
Image

properly baffled oil pan with windage tray
Image
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: building a custom wet sump oil pan

Postby 87vette81big » July 22nd, 2014, 12:29 pm

Interesting find Grumpy the Dyno charts.
The Old HO Racing Pontiac Books I have list Dyno claims of 20-25 HP increase alone using the Factory 1965-69 Full lenngth windage tray Vs without it.
There is a built in crank scraper too. Crank scraper is not as good as as a Hand fabricated part but still present. for all 8 Rod throws..

Bought a 3rd factory Poncho full length windage tray.
I have 4 all together now. That's enough for all future Poncho & Olds V8 engine builds I have in mind.
Only 426 Hemi had similar windage trays.
Not sure why not on all Musclecar era engines.
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Re: building a custom wet sump oil pan

Postby Indycars » December 8th, 2014, 3:35 pm


Getting rid of a 20 year old computer. Before I did I pulled the guts out and
saved the case. Looks like good material for an oil pan modification, the metal
is .050 inches thick. This case is considerably heavier than the ones I get today.

The hard drive cage is two 15 inch sections that could be put side-by-side and
used for a windage tray.

ComputerCaseToOilPan_5791.jpg


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