Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System



Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby grumpyvette » November 13th, 2012, 1:07 pm

Image

viewtopic.php?f=80&t=8505&p=29830&hilit=clear+vinyl#p29830

Image

THANK YOU! FOR THE UPDATED PICTURE

Image

Its been my experience that, careful measurement and a trip to the local hydraulic supply fabrication guys with a detailed diagram will usually result in exactly what you need being custom fabricated to your needs at a very reasonable cost


Ive generally used two reducer brass female fittings with two AN#8 and one AN#6 fitting and flex hose between all connections with swivel connectors, (please clean up my ugly diagram, but it should give you the idea
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby Indycars » November 13th, 2012, 4:04 pm


I knew I was making it too complicated. The Y-Blocks would have
looked nice, but over $50 for two of them.

This drawing keeps evolving.....I added the Fuel Shutoff Valve
that I had forgotten. Plus the two Tee's you suggested.

It's damn hard to draw a straight line free-handed as you noticed. :)

FuelSystemDiagram02.jpg


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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby bytor » November 22nd, 2012, 2:12 pm

Hey Indy, decided on a carb yet? This one may be a bit much but I haven't seen it before.

http://www.prosystemsracing.com/svseries.html

http://www.competitionplus.com/drag-rac ... tor-design

Interesting design concept.
My 383 build photos
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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby grumpyvette » November 22nd, 2012, 3:22 pm

the carburetor itself looks good but you need a 4500 Holley compatible intake and at $1220 PLUS per carburetor its sure not cheap.


personally if I was going to spend $1200 plus on a carburetor....

Image

http://store.summitracing.com/parts/edl-2025



but if it was my car Id be more likely to go this route
http://store.summitracing.com/parts/hly ... dia/images
Image

http://store.summitracing.com/parts/edl-8713
Image
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby Indycars » November 23rd, 2012, 9:15 pm


At $1200 I don't have to worry about about how good it is, cause I can't afford that. I've been leaning toward the Speed Demon, but I've yet to read about anyone that has bought a carb since the company came back.

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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby Indycars » November 30th, 2012, 6:55 pm


I purchased most of the fuel system today while the shipping was free on Summit, ends tonight
at mid-night. I still need the 2 Tee's at the carburetor, fuel shut off valve and some 3/8" fuel
line. So maybe another $25.......Ok, Ok, you don't have to shout at me!!! .....so take
the estimate and triple it to $75. :D :P

The only item that changed from the original list was the vent filter (row 12), since it was
going to be a special order. Turned out to be a good thing, because I found a better fit for
the 1/2" line that I'm using.

I estimated a $100 for the AN fittings, but it ended up costing $157.64. I used the diagram
below for reference while searching for the fitting, but it does NOT tell me everything, I
needed a fitting to pass thru the frame(line 20). Most likely I've got something wrong or
will have to buy more, but this is my best guess at my needs. Never run any AN lines/fittings
before so it will be a learning experience for me. Also in the total purchase price are
fittings(lines 22,23 & 24) that will be welded to my aluminum gas tank (Beer Keg),
although they weren't part of my original plan.

Below is a picture of what I bought, but just above that is the actual Excel spreadsheet
with links to every item. Plus there are links to the manufacture's manual for the fuel
pump and pressure regulator. Again I was glad I checked the manufactures website,
because I found out that the Mallory Pressure Regulator comes with the "AN O-Ring"
fittings, which saved me about $24.

Fuel System - Purchased Prices.xlsx


Fuel System - Purchased Prices01.jpg


For your reference again, same diagram as before:

FuelSystemDiagram02.jpg


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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby grumpyvette » November 30th, 2012, 7:17 pm

it looks like your doing everything too specs that easily allow your engine to run at, or even above 500plus hp with zero restrictions
you should have zero problems.


just a bit of info
people rarely weld AN style fuel line fittings directly to a fuel tank.
they weld female bungs designed for that, the reason is that the fuel fittings themselves, are less easily damaged and easily replaced.
Image
Russell 640100 Fitting Bung Weld-In Female 8 AN Aluminum

http://store.summitracing.com/search?ke ... 0100&dds=1
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby Indycars » December 1st, 2012, 5:55 pm


Thanks, that's a good idea for the fuel outlet. The other two connections
(Vent & Return Line) are in a tight spot between the tank and body. So I
will probably go with the direct weld AN connection there.

I did a search on Summit and the prices range from $4.95 to $21.96, quite
a wide range on the prices. Looks like the one with a flange would provide
a better weld, so I might go with this one from Summit for $6.95.

http://store.summitracing.com/parts/sum ... /overview/

Bung_HalfInchNPT.jpg


ALL Summit 1/2" Aluminum Bungs
http://store.summitracing.com/search/de ... l/aluminum

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- Check Out My Dart SHP Engine Project: viewtopic.php?f=69&t=3814
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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby Indycars » December 5th, 2012, 7:27 pm


The components I purchased from Summit came in two shipments. I can confirm
that the Mallory pressure regulator does come with 2 AN fittings, so it's not as
expensive as it looks at first. Summit does not show the fittings included.

FuelSystemPurchaseSummit01_3483.jpg
FuelSystemPurchaseSummit02_3484.jpg


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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby grumpyvette » December 5th, 2012, 7:34 pm

There is zero doubt, that ,your going to have a damn impressive car when your done!

viewtopic.php?f=55&t=211&p=23798&hilit=tube+bending#p23798

viewtopic.php?f=55&t=4381&p=16285&hilit=flex+fuel+line#p16285
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby Indycars » December 5th, 2012, 7:54 pm

grumpyvette wrote:There is zero doubt, that ,your going to have a damn impressive car when your done!

And NO money for gas after I get done spending !!! ;)

Thanks you Sir!


Rick
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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby Indycars » December 7th, 2012, 10:18 am


It was necessary to order another tool so I can make the fuel lines with AN fittings
that require a 37° flare. The Ridgid 377 got some excellent reviews so I ordered one
from Amazon, but it ships from Toolup.

Notice how it clamps on the tube you are working on, not out at the very end.

Ridgid 41162 Model 377 37 degree SAE Ratcheting Flaring Tool will flare
Steelhard, Copper, Stainless Steel and Brass thru wall thickness of 0.35". The
ratcheting feed screw Handle turns easily and requires less motion and effort
than a standard Handle. Hardened Steel flaring concentrically mounted in
needle bearings produces rolling Action for even metal flow.


http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001B1 ... 00_s00_i00

Rigid-377-Flaring-Tool.jpg


While on Amazon I can across the 1/2" ball valve that I needed for my fuel shutoff.

HalfInchBallValve.jpg


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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby grumpyvette » December 7th, 2012, 10:35 am

that flare tools one of those tools you seldom use but is well worth the cost in less aggravation, doing the job correctly without having problems, and much better quality work when you do use it!, than you would get from the typical , cheap, and flimsy, auto parts store imported tool that never seems to work well, or be consistent.
you always debate the cost of tools like that because many times you can buy already flared tubing or have a local shop do the flares for you, but once you buy and use the tool you kick yourself for not purchasing it years ago!

http://www.amazon.com/Ti-Industries--Ca ... aulic+line

http://store.fedhillusa.com/britishgirl ... tings.aspx
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby Indycars » December 12th, 2012, 3:16 pm


Got the Rigid 37° flaring tool in yesterday and just had to try it, so I cut me a 6 inch
piece of 1/2 inch aluminum fuel line.

Line up the arrow with the index line, then you can tighten the clamp and it will be
located such that it fits the divot on the side.

Rigid377_Tool01_3505.jpg
Rigid377_Tool02_3503.jpg


Features
http://www.ridgid.com/Tools/458R-Ratche ... /index.htm

- This precision tool provides smooth, uniform flares with minimum effort.

- The new ratcheting feed screw handle turns easily and requires less motion and effort
than a standard handle.

- Hardened steel flaring cone, eccentrically mounted in needle bearings, produces
rolling action for even metal flow, giving uniform flare walls without galling.



Rigid377_Tool03_3506.jpg
Rigid377_Tool04_3508.jpg

Rigid377_Tool06_3514.jpg


This is the only problem I noticed in the short time that I used it.

Rigid377_Tool05_3512.jpg

Rigid377_37°_Flare_Tool_Pg01.jpg
Rigid377_37°_Flare_Tool_Pg02.jpg


Download the PDF file below:

Rigid377_37°_Flare_Tool.pdf



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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby grumpyvette » December 12th, 2012, 3:46 pm

another OUTSTANDING POST! THANK YOU!
IF YOU CAN,T SMOKE THE TIRES AT WILL,FROM A 60 MPH ROLLING START YOUR ENGINE NEEDS MORE WORK!!"!
IF YOU CAN , YOU NEED BETTER TIRES AND YOUR SUSPENSION NEEDS MORE WORK!!
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Re: Component Selection & Design for 500 HP Fuel System

Postby Indycars » December 14th, 2012, 7:56 pm


When looking for a shutoff valve to go between the fuel tank and the 100 micron Pre-Filter
I found this 316 Stainless Steel Ball Valve on Amazon for $15. Will probably polish the outside
at some point. I also noticed that there are what's call a Mini-Valve, but upon further
inspection it had what's called a "Reduced Port", so beware that some ball valves for any
particular size can have a internal size that is less than the valve size which would restrict flow.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B006VC ... 02_s00_i00

ShutoffValveHalfInch01_3517.jpg
ShutoffValveHalfInch02_3519.jpg
ShutoffValveHalfInch03_3520.jpg


Typical Mini Ball Valve Configuration

MiniBallValve.jpg


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Rick
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- Check Out My Dart SHP Engine Project: viewtopic.php?f=69&t=3814
- Need a Dynamic Compression Ratio Calculator: viewtopic.php?f=99&t=4458
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